Balkan vipers

The place for new fieldguides and discussions on books on field herpetology, description and discussion on new (sub)species, etc.

Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:25 pm

Thomas Bader wrote:Yes Bero, I meant the second one between croatica and macrops. Dusan presented it last year in Vienna and if I remember correctly, it was quite a clear border with a high difference between the two clades

They do seem to be well separated genetically, but to find the physical border in the field, one needs many more
field trips... And Bosnia is heavily mined, which does not help... We have an "educated guess" where the border
MIGHT lie, but it has to be confirmed by more DATA.
You may have noticed that in this paper they do not insist on subspecies at all - for most of the time they just talk
about the SPECIES V. ursinii in this region, whatever it might comprise.
BTW, the conspicuous wide gap between Montenegro and Macedonia proved NOT to divide what we expected...
the "educated guess" proved too nice & simple to be true... which was a nice warning not to jump to conclusions
too fast in other cases as well.
Patience, my friend. People are working on it, and I'm also eager to hear the final results.
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Thomas Bader » Thu Feb 07, 2013 9:05 am

Thank you Bero for your detailled clarifications!
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:40 am

Berislav Horvatic wrote:the conspicuous wide gap between Montenegro and Macedonia

Is this a true gap? I don't know the region at all, so this might be a silly question, but is the available sampling sufficient to guestimate that? Lack of potential habitat?
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Daniel Bohle » Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:17 am

Jeroen Speybroeck wrote:Is this a true gap?

I would say yes, looking at google you can see that there is a "line" with altitudes around 600 meters between both areas.
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:43 pm

Not quite a "line" - just have a look at the map of the Balkan peninsula in an oldfashioned atlas - it's much
more obvious than in "Google Earth":

Dinarisches_Gebirge_SE.jpg

There is a rather broad lowland region separating the southeastern Dinarides and the Scardo-Pindic
(Šara-Pindos) mountain range. Just follow the rivers Bojana and Drim/Drin upstream... then Beli Drim
(Alb.: Drini i Bardhë) further upstream...
Metohija is is a large basin and the name of the region covering the southwestern part of Kosovo. It is
23 km wide at its broadest point and about 60 km long, at an average altitude of 450 m above sea level.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metohija
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Thu Feb 07, 2013 5:35 pm

Great! Love that map.
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Ilian Velikov » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:35 pm

Great! Love that map.


If you like this map maybe you'll enjoy this if you don't know about it yet - http://www.maps-for-free.com/
It's basicly the same style of maps but online and you can control layers and use the maps for free.
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Re: Balkan vipers

Postby Guillaume Gomard » Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:59 am

Thanks for the link Ilian, very useful!
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