Bulgarian Anguis

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Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Bobby Bok » Mon Oct 20, 2014 8:46 pm

I just returned after a great autumn trip to Romania and Bulgaria along with several forum members. We found two Anguis spec. in Bulgaria around Primorsko that we found rather hard to identify as little (or nothing?) is known about its distribution in Bulgaria.

In the book of Stojanov et al. 2011 I read both species of Slow Worm occur in Bulgaria and based on distribution our individuals should be Anguis colchica. Morphologically they also resemble Anguis colchica with a well visible ear-opening and 26 longitudinal scale rows. But then again, all of these characteristics are rather variable and I don't trust that book too much as it contains some incorrect info as well...

The paper of Gvozdik et al. 2010 hints more in the direction of Anguis fragilis if I look at the overall distribution of Anguis fragilis in comparison to Anguis colchica but data from the Bulgarian coast lack.

Is there someone here who knows more about this topic and can tell me which Anguis occur at the Southern Bulgarian coast i.e. which species did I find?

bal37.jpg
Anguis spec.
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Mario Schweiger » Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:30 am

Hi Bobby,

it should/must/has to be colchica ;)
by distribution, dorsal scale rows, ear opening
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Please visit also my personal Herp-site vipersgarden.at
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:33 am

Distribution is unresolved, morphology has been shown to be indecisive (and is ever more so when based on a single animal). Only guessing is possible, although I'd also rather expect it to be colchica. There's nothing (that I know of) published other than what you already referred too.
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Bobby Bok » Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:46 pm

Thanks for the input guys! A. colchica it is then...
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Tue Oct 21, 2014 3:56 pm

Bobby Bok wrote:Thanks for the input guys! A. colchica it is then...


?
No, Anguis sp.
Or maybe Anguis cf. colchica, if you have to.
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Ilian Velikov » Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:35 pm

I don't know more than what's been said already on this matter but I would like to see a full report from this trip :)
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Sean Cole » Tue Oct 21, 2014 10:37 pm

Well it seems the morphological data point to colchica, but only the genetic data will prove conclusive. Which paper gives a summary of the latter?

I believe there is genetic material which can be analysed to solve this one?

The distribution would surely indicate colchica, given its presence so closely to the north? Nature does not play tricks exclusively for Herp listers!
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:24 am

Sean Cole wrote:Which paper gives a summary of the latter?

I am still rather on top of things, as plans exist to update the 2010 review. If such paper would exist, Mario or I would know about it pretty soon. If Bobby would have clipped a tail and sent it to Gvozdik et al. this might have resolved things, but in the mean time we'll have to wait and see. Nearest ascertained samples are fragilis, yet distance as the crow flies is a too rough assessment of specific affiliation, as the wider area is characterised by multiple known and potential biogeographical barriers, including rivers (Evros, Danube, Struma/Strymonas, ...) and mountain ranges (Rhodopes, Pirin, Carpathians, ...).

Please check the map in Gvozdik et al. if you haven't done so already.
http://vipersgarden.at/PDF_files/PDF-1963.pdf

The description of Anguis veronensis includes a sample east of the Carpathians which is attributed to colchica, yet it's located in Moldova (= not next door to S BG).
http://vipersgarden.at/PDF_files/PDF-5678.pdf

This is all the available evidence to date, as far as I know. It is surely unfortunate that the initial species split did not include contact zone sampling and study of reproductive isolation in such areas, but let's wait and see. I would imagine it is unlikely that the disjunct range of colchica to the east of the Black Sea would be interspersed by fragilis in S Bulgaria and surrounding area, but if you look at the range of the crested newts in that part of Europe, it is likely to assume too much. In the mean time, we are stuck with uncertainty.

BTW, Bobby, while splitting hairs over your lifelist:
* It includes a 50% ambrosii-introgressed Speleomantes "italicus".
* Then there's the confusing and erronous specific attribution of green toads from Sicily in your report.
http://www.herpsafari.nl/tripreports-eu ... ia-sicily/
You cannot use both Bufo viridis siculus and Bufo boulengeri. The NE of Sicily is occupied by balearicus, regardless of whether you treat the latter as a full species or a subspecies of viridis. The rest of the islands is occupied by siculus, which can be treated as a subspecies of viridis only if you do the same with boulengeri. If not, you can either treat it as a subspecies of boulengeri or as a species in its own right. Getting back to the animals you photographed, it is most likely that none of them are (pure) siculus, while the ones from Partinico must have been. To be precise (but furthermore of limited relevance to the issue), I think the evidence to attribute all to the genus Bufotes is sufficiently compelling.
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Vlad Cioflec » Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:27 am

I think the evidence to attribute all to the genus Bufotes is sufficiently compelling.


Can you please point out some of this recent evidence for the shy romanian herpers that asked me post this question? ;) Thanks!
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Re: Bulgarian Anguis

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Wed Oct 22, 2014 1:14 pm

Vlad Cioflec wrote:
I think the evidence to attribute all to the genus Bufotes is sufficiently compelling.


Can you please point out some of this recent evidence for the shy romanian herpers that asked me post this question? ;) Thanks!


See reasoning and references page 36 =>
http://molevol.cmima.csic.es/carranza/p ... phibia.pdf
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