L. vulgaris or L. helveticus?

[Matthijs Hollanders]

Hello people,

Found this newt with another one near Tilburg, Noord-Brabant, NL, on Sunday under a small log next to a pond that has both species of Lissotriton. What did I find? I sure hope I got the last salamander species I needed in NL...



Matthijs

[Bobby Bok]

I would love to see a picture of the underside of the animal!

[Laura Bok]

I would love to see a picture of the underside of the animal!

You´re such a pervert

[Matthijs Hollanders]

Don't have one. Chin was unspeckled, as was the belly. Sorry...

[Daniel Kane]

Unspeckled throat and belly points to helveticus rather than vulgaris. Was that the one you were after?

[Matthijs Hollanders]

Sure was. Is the unspeckled throat a reliable diagnostic in larvae/efts?

[Daniel Kane]

Nice one. How many more species do you have left to see in The Netherlands now? I am not sure if the speckled throats are developed in efts of vulgaris, but I can't imagine that helveticus efts would be spotted and the adults not.

[Matthijs Hollanders]

Well, I'm not gonna count this one. I'll tentatively say I *probably* got one. I need Pelobates, ridibundus, Bombina, Alytes, Coronella, helveticus, although there are a few species I'd like to get better pictures of. All of those are easily managed before mid-2013.

[Jeroen Speybroeck]

Supposedly, efts of helveticus have a vertebral stripe of constant intensity, while it's fading towards the tail in vulgaris...
Larvae are not reliably distinguishable.
Belly spots increase in number and intensity some how, although often present.
More reliable is the pinkish colour of the throat, while belly is yellow and not orange, but it can be difficult.

[Liam Russell]

Belly spots aren't reliable for efts. I would say this is almost certainly vulgaris because of the lack of dorsal stripe - unless continental ones differ from the UK...